A sweet-looking Wii title without a publisher: Winter...




Posted by Prince Shondronai

http://wii.ign.com/articles/946/946492p1.html

I love adventure games, and this one looks pretty good. Not that I believe for a minute it'll work, but here's the online petition to get it a publisher in case anyone wants to sign:

http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?wiinter




Posted by Speedfreak

There's nothing really there that looks that great. I guess some Wii fans are desperate for anything that isn't minigames or, well, garbage.




Posted by #061402

Why was Lisa Trevor in there?




Posted by Prince Shondronai


Quoting Speedfreak: There's nothing really there that looks that great. I guess some Wii fans are desperate for anything that isn't minigames or, well, garbage.


Hmph. I'm just desperate for good exploration/adventure games in general. So much so that I'll actually be checking out sony's heavy rain when it's released. It could change my opinion of the company slightly, even, if it's good.



Posted by Kutlass

Looks exactly like the sort of game i didn't get a wii for.




Posted by ExoXile

I'd try it.




Posted by Big Boss


Quoting Prince Shondronai: Hmph. I'm just desperate for good exploration/adventure games in general. So much so that I'll actually be checking out sony's heavy rain when it's released. It could change my opinion of the company slightly, even, if it's good.


As pleasurable as it would be to read a post of yours genuinly liking a game without your retarded comments on Sony, I should point out Heavy Rain is being developed by French developer Quantic Dream, and not one of Sony's internal studios. They made Indigo Prophecy, which is the best adventure game I've played on a console, closely besting Dreamfall: The Longest Journey. It's available for download on XBL under the Xbox Originals section.

I suggest sticking to the PC for adventure games, though. There's a plethora of adventure titles still being released that few are paying attention to.




Posted by Prince Shondronai

Yeah, that's the only type of game I play on the PC, aside from the Ys series, all which needs to be localized for current consoles sometime around last year.




Posted by Vampiro V. Empire

So it's basically just silent hill without the atmosphere and effects? Not that great. Though there's monster tit at the end, so I guess that's a plus?


Quoted post: So much so that I'll actually be checking out sony's heavy rain when it's released. It could change my opinion of the company slightly, even, if it's good.



Man, can't wait for an entire game based around qtes. nothing better than barely playing the game



Posted by BLUNTMASTER X

whatever happened to sadness

and project hammer




Posted by Vampiro V. Empire

project hammer got canceled awhile ago. sadness? who cares. madworld pretty much replaces it




Posted by Speedfreak

Heavy Rain is a stream of Quick Timer events, what the hell is wrong with both of you?

There's another survival/adventure game on Wii ALSO set in the mountains ALSO with good graphics that already has a publisher. The name is something really generic like "Cold Mountain".




Posted by Vampiro V. Empire


Quoted post: Heavy Rain is a stream of Quick Timer events, what the hell is wrong with both of you?


Seriously. Game looked good until the action kicked in and that's all I saw. Pass.



Posted by Speedfreak

I'd excuse it if it was context sensitive, but it's not. You never know what the button you need to press to perform some arbitrary action will be until it flashes on screen. It's like the laziest game design you can possibly do.




Posted by Vampiro V. Empire

No kidding. I don't mind QTEs in certain situations like *** of War and the cutscenes of RE4. But Heavy Rain pretty much blows every other game out of the water in terms of how horribly used they are. By far the laziest I've seen, which is a shame since it's a really pretty game.




Posted by Speedfreak

Maybe you'd mind them if I said "for every QTE in a game that's one less genuine bit of gameplay".




Posted by Vampiro V. Empire

In the case of GoW, what, I'm gonna do all those intricate moves on a cyclops face? Nah, QTEs suffice. You still killed the thing, it's just a flashy way to end it. As for RE4, I can either just press forward on a thumbstick or mash A and B really quick. The latter is actually a better decision. Some cases, when used well and rarely, QTEs are good. That's just often not the case.




Posted by Speedfreak

The QTE includes the cutscene, not just the button pressed during it. Instead of a QTE to kill the monster you could have a move that's difficult to pull off unless the monster has taken sufficient damage, for instance. *** Hand shows this pretty well (even if it does have QTEs in it too).




Posted by Vampiro V. Empire

*** Hand is, though, a more difficult game. GoW was clearly not designed with difficulty in mind. It's straight-forward and flashy, marketed broadly. Unlike *** Hand that wasn't marketed, well, at all and though flashy, wasn't necessarily straight-forward. Can't really compare the two since QTEs fit the design choices of GoW. It works for them.

Also, this was the game you mentioned if anyone was interested:

http://kotaku.com/5137107/cursed-mountain-screens-are-cursed-mountainous

Cursed Mountain. Generic name and horrible main character.




Posted by Speedfreak

Just because GoW is easier it doesn't mean it necessitates QTEs. The exact example I gave could be done only easier. However, if you're suggesting that it's a game designed for idiots and marketed as style over substance and as such needs QTEs to make it substanceless then yeah, I agree. Otherwise the arguement that a flashy game needs QTEs makes no sense, most of us could spew out a huge list of flashy looking, not overly difficult games that don't rely on b[COLOR=lightgreen]u[/COLOR]llshit game design.




Posted by Prince Shondronai

Ugh, that is discouraging about heavy rain. Still, if the exploration, puzzles and story are entertaining (I really know next-to-nothing about the game), I might still enjoy it.




Posted by Vampiro V. Empire


Quoted post: ust because GoW is easier it doesn't mean it necessitates QTEs.

Otherwise the arguement that a flashy game needs QTEs makes no sense, most of us could spew out a huge list of flashy looking, not overly difficult games that don't rely on bull**** game design.


Pretty sure I never said anything close to that. Simply said that, for the type of game, QTEs work. It didn't need them, but it had them and it was a pretty good use of them.

And I don't know how your example was easier. Either your pull off a "difficult" combo or wait until the monster is damaged and then... watch as the computer takes over to finish it off? No thanks, I'd honestly rather the QTEs. Plus, this isn't ninja gaiden. If GoW fans wanted difficult, long combos they'd play, well, Ninja Gaiden.



Posted by Speedfreak

I didn't say difficult combo, I said difficult move. Perhaps one that requires good timing. Why can't *** of War have a finishing move that's as difficult to pull off as a QTE but isn't so disjointed and, well, shit?




Posted by Vampiro V. Empire

QTEs are essentially combos that you don't have to memorize. Whether it's a combo or a move, both require more than the average GoW/hack-and-slash fan probably wants to put in in terms of length, timing or memorization. QTEs essentially solve that by giving lenient timing and putting the combo right on screen. It's being developed to the base it's marketed to. Simple as that.

Plus, I don't find them that disjointed really. Not as smooth as something equal to Ninja Gaiden or even Devil May Cry, but GoW is a much simpler game than either. Probably explains why it sells so much better than either of those series.




Posted by Speedfreak

QTEs are disjointed because they turn previously contextual button functions, where you know what those buttons do at all times, into complete nonsense. It's just a game of random simon-says while some magical, impossible bullshit occurs behind it. You could black out the entire screen apart from the button icons and it would still work, you don't even need to see the action. Video games are not about pressing buttons purely because they tell you to, it's about pressing buttons because you know exactly what those buttons do and you understand the context of those functions.

If you can't see why that's stupid then...hm...I don't think you're actually allowed to have an opinion on video games anymore.




Posted by #061402

It's funny how Speedfreak is so obviously one of those "My way or the ****in' highway, pal" kind of guys.




Posted by Vampiro V. Empire


Quoted post: QTEs are disjointed because they turn previously contextual button functions, where you know what those buttons do at all times, into complete nonsense. It's just a game of random simon-says while some magical, impossible bull**** occurs behind it. You could black out the entire screen apart from the button icons and it would still work, you don't even need to see the action. Video games are not about pressing buttons purely because they tell you to, it's about pressing buttons because you know exactly what those buttons do and you understand the context of those functions.


That really isn't an issue unless you're an idiot. I've never heard of someone bring up that specific point, that QTEs are bad because it changes what the buttons do. That's pretty much the most minor issue with QTEs.

As for blacking out the screen, sure you could do that, but then there'd be no payoff to them at all. So... uh, what? But good luck trying to develop a combat system that lets you do what QTEs in GoW allow you to do. Not even Ninja Gaiden is capable of such intricate moves, and that's by far the most advanced combat-system in the hack-and-slash genre. I mean, what you get in GoW is pretty much a mini cinematic that allows you to have limited input in. It's either press buttons or watch a cutscene. Or not have anything at all. Which probably wouldn't fly with GoW fans.



Posted by Speedfreak

[quote=#061402;922447]It's funny how Speedfreak is so obviously one of those "My way or the ****in' highway, pal" kind of guys.

Hi, you must be new here.

[quote=Vampiro V. Empire;922492]That really isn't an issue unless you're an idiot. I've never heard of someone bring up that specific point, that QTEs are bad because it changes what the buttons do. That's pretty much the most minor issue with QTEs.

As for blacking out the screen, sure you could do that, but then there'd be no payoff to them at all. So... uh, what? But good luck trying to develop a combat system that lets you do what QTEs in GoW allow you to do. Not even Ninja Gaiden is capable of such intricate moves, and that's by far the most advanced combat-system in the hack-and-slash genre. I mean, what you get in GoW is pretty much a mini cinematic that allows you to have limited input in. It's either press buttons or watch a cutscene. Or not have anything at all. Which probably wouldn't fly with GoW fans.

My issue isn't with changing the buttons, button functions change with context all the time. The difference with QTEs is that the context is also removed because the button's are randomised. It goes from "press this sequence of buttons to perform a move you already know in this given to context" to Simon Says. Giving a game designer a million dollars and having him come up with Simon-f[COLOR=lightgreen]u[/COLOR]cking-Says is not my idea of money well-spent. Simon-f[COLOR=lightgreen]u[/COLOR]cking-Says is not anyone with a brain's idea of Quality Interactive Entertainment. Critics encouraging developers to implement Simon-f[COLOR=lightgreen]u[/COLOR]cking-Says with different cutscenes playing behind it is not any kind of advancement of the medium. It's Simon-f[COLOR=lightgreen]u[/COLOR]cking-Says.

If all GoW fans want is cinemetic cutscenes with minor interactivity then they might as well go rent a movie and put a sticky not on the screen that reads "fist yourself". These fucktards shouldn't have any influence over good design.




Posted by Vampiro V. Empire

Given that QTEs make up, oh, less than 2% of the entire experience how can that really be an issue? It's obviously not the best idea around (it's abysmal in pretty much every game) but as I said there's not really a better solution if you don't want to take absolute control away from the player. Having the buttons randomized or making you press the correct button (X is always for sword, etc) at the right time doesn't really make a lick of difference. It's just a way to keep a player on his toes, nothing more. Not to mention a way to make sure everyone gets the same flashy experience while keeping it as basic as possible. Again, going back to Ninja Gaiden, there's a large difference between how experts play the game and how everyone else plays. Being that the former has an experience that's incredible and has maximum violence while everyone else sticks with basic, easy combos, and thus, basic violence. GoW just makes sure everyone gets the "experts experience" without forcing dedication or memorization.

Again, I'm not defending QTEs in general, just the use of it in GoW as it's one of the very, very few games that have actually used it well.