Here's a small, but informative article with quotes from developers on why some games just suck:
[quote]http://www.gameinformer.com/News/Story/200807/N08.0728.1502.11210.htm?Page=1
"The problem isn
Yeah, I read up on that article not too long ago. It makes a lot of sense and points out problems that game designers have with trying to complete a product by said deadline or with interference by some retail store.
Also:
[quote=Dean Martinetti Producer, Spark Unlimited]I have never ever had a developer that didn’t put enough time in or not want more time to make a product better.
I don't doubt that one bit.
Good read.
I read something on Gamasutra a couple of weeks ago and it said something like "how does a carefully scheduled project end up 6 weeks behind? One day at a time".
Those were some real horror stories though.
Very similar to the kinds of things I learned could ruin a movie shooting last semester. An interesting read.
Considering Too Human has been in the pipeline for ten years, a few weeks would be nothing for SK.
doesn't really count until it's finally made on the actual system it's coming out on. So 3 years tops.
and still it's a piece of ****
good job crybaby dyack
gonna go punch him in the face when it comes out. Only, like, five miles away.
Give him one for me for Eternal Darkness. And Twin Snakes. And if Soul Reaver sucks then tell him it's just for existing.
I like Twin Snakes better than the original :o
Despite it being ridiculously easy because of the completely broken gameplay?
idk why, I just enjoyed it more. Even after playing both versions numerous times.
[quote=Speedfreak;871239]Despite it being ridiculously easy because of the completely broken gameplay?difficulty modes exist for a reason
It's easy because the new mechanics didn't fit the old environments and Dyack was too busy marvelling over the fact that he was working on a Kojima game to notice. That's the core of the problem. Cranking up the difficulty doesn't make it play any better, it's still a total mismatch.
I... liked the new gameplay bits better than original's too :o
i like the part where solid snake realizes he is the one and destroys the agents
[quote=Vampiro V. Empire;871304]I... liked the new gameplay bits better than original's too :o
Not really my point. It's just sorta like having access to a Racoon Suit in Super Mario Bros and throwing in 10,000 goombas to compensate. It's a clusterfuck of game design.
ALL RIGHT. Didn't really notice any broken gameplay, beyond typical mgs stuff though...
Speedfreak: #1 expert on games he has never played
or is that bebop
aren't they the same thing?
THE ENGLISH LIQUID AND SOLID SNAKE
bebop is solid snake
cause solid snake is a troll
I played Twin Snakes, it was like shooting fish in a barrel.
Oh yeah, it was Bebop who thought he was king of video game knowledge after playing ten minutes of MGS.
I retract my statement, your honor.
It was his copy that I played. He got a PS2 and completed MGS years before I got my PS2, too.
We're really more like the Mario brothers, I figure.
To be honest I made an arse of myself in this post and its embarrasing to even look at it for me...
[quote=Vasioth;871549]9 Months doesn't a what? Sorry but I'm looking at preverb Engrish on the go even as I type.
because pseudo-intellectual doesn't a literate person make
Dunno who you're talking to because I sure as hell don't give a crap about MGS. I just noticed that from MGS2 to Twin Snakes the already annoying mechanics became so redundant it was like playing a real version of Super Chuck Norris.
Hahahaha oh ****, deleting your post because of a derep
just get out
You don't really look much better right now, man.
I never deleted it because of De-Rep, it was just a nonsense post. There's a difference between that but a guy who's making an arsehole of himself right now probably wouldn't understand that in the slightess.
And oh okay, should've read that more carefully then... still the mechanics in MGS2 aren't that... *pause* ... ... bad?
I love how much MGS causes arguments on here.
Especially when some guy who never posts tries to come in and school everyone with his superior intellect.
Vasioth: Renegade intellectual bad-boy on the edge, scourge of all us deluded fanboys.
It's not that I've never posted, I've been a member here awhile. Pretty much been posting since before Kit was a member infact, all's it is "is" another account... (Don't ask why either)...
And LOL I had to admit I actually liked the post above me. Maybe it is a percise assumption of what I am on these forums, still. I just thought MGS would be a prime example to slag off as it was mentioned quiet a lot throughout the thread anyway and what I said is literally true about it. The story behind every MGS game is practically like it's been given to a 14 year old to write. The Voice Actors are also Solid gold. But I'm not saying I hate the game, I'm just saying after the first MGS I was really dissapointed in the rest of them and it put me off them entirely (especially the talks in MGS 2 with ***** 1 - Raiden and ***** 2 - His Girlfriend). I'm actually going to take back what I say, MGS3 was far supperior to MGS2 and had much better bosses ( the twist about Revolver Ocelot at least told you why he was in the bloody games to begin with) and the stealth was pretty bloody good which is where the revival in the Tactical Espionage gameplay to the series.
I'll also say aswell that I actually didn't mind Metal Gear Acid aswell though it takes a lot of guts to say that without being Crucified on the big cross yourself.
I'll stop complaining about the series anymore though before I do insult a fanboy. Sorry a lot?
You can like the game or not, but to bash the workable mechanics of one of the most respectable entries to the gaming industry that is said to revolutionize certain things? That's silly. There's obviously a lot of the development you are not aware of. That's like saying Miyamoto doesn't have an effect on designers anymore.
Anywho, everyone knows that Twin Snakes had broken gameplay for a variety of reasons, including the first-person shooting ability taken from MGS2.
Biggest MGS fan ever backs me up. END OF.
Not to say it wasn't good, but it was broken. I took down Ocelot in the C4 room in three headshots, no joke. It took me a hell of a lot longer in the original just because there wasn't the ability to aim in first person. Also, it made the fight with Vulcan Raven a lot easier because you could see in first person and throw a grenade at the same time.
Also the cutscenes. I was actually laughing at how stupid they were. Didn't he kick a missile or something near the end?
If you liked Ac!d more than MGS2, then the series as a whole is really not meant for you.
[quote=Vasioth;872190]They made it work again in MGS3 without the radar and the Camo system which I actually thought was a great advancement from MGS2.
This is the game where you can't see where the **** you're going and have to open a menu screen and change clothes every time you squat in a different coloured bush or lie down in different coloured grass? Fiddlier, more illogical mechanics are progress to you?
I think when he means 'broken' he's referring to how it imbalanced the gameplay.
Yeah, I got that. Didn't bother me one bit! Made the controls less frustrating if anything.
Back to Metal Gear, AGAIN? Fuuuuck. Just when I thought everything that could be said about Metal Gear and Metal Gear Sold had been done; spanning across several threads, with VGC members draining all their time and resources in proving the other wong; it comes back alive stronger than ever. How the hell did this happen?
I read BB's article. Solution: Owner's of studios should stop being in such a **** hurray to finish art.
[quote=Iron Koala;873003]Back to Metal Gear, AGAIN? Fuuuuck. Just when I thought everything that could be said about Metal Gear and Metal Gear Sold had been done; spanning across several threads, with VGC members draining all their time and resources in proving the other wong; it comes back alive stronger than ever. How the hell did this happen?
I read BB's article. Solution: Owner's of studios should stop being in such a **** hurray to finish art.
Assuming that games are a valid art form, not all games are intended as art. It's very difficult to make any money from games at all, that's why sometimes the game has to be pushed out the door before they run out of money.
I have understood why good games go bad for a long time, but I really only noticed it when Fable came out. Fable was a game that was meant to be massive, the size of Morrowind or Oblivion, with all of the features of REAL LIFE! But then it disappointed me, and many others, to be little more than a hack and slash adventure game. It was pushed out the door a little early, probably once the budget had been over-stepped a bit.
This is one thing I hate about gaming companies. As a gamer, I am willing to wait for a good game. Rare made us wait how long for Banjo-Kazooie and Perfect Dark? And once we got the game, it didn't matter! Most game companies need to realize that gamers care about the quality of the game, and are willing to play the same game they've been playing for months until a better one comes out. With that said, I'm going to go play some Halo and Call of Duty, maybe try to Full Combo "Cult of Personality" on Guitar Hero, and hope and pray that 3DRealms is actually working on Duke Nukem Forever, and I'll see it and play it before I die.
I find it kind of ironic that the better Zelda games were the ones they did actually "push out the door", or at least didn't worry over it so much that they'd delay it multiple times.
Yeah but I never really liked Twilight Princess that much for some reason. I mean it had practically everything you could just about ask for in a Zelda game... but it still felt like something was missing and it wasn't as addictive as other Zelda titles such as Majora's Mask, OTT or ALTTP. Or maybe you meant TP due to the fact you said "delayed it multiple times".
It could just be me though that never really liked TP that much at all..
Wasn't WW horribly rushed? IDK DUDE
Wind Waker was shoved out the door prematurely because of the huge games drought the Gamecube had. There is soooo much half-baked content hidden on the disk.
If it took its time it'd be the best Zelda, hands down. SHAME
But wait wasn't the Minish Cap another rushed game which ended up turning out pretty well? Or are we talking about real Zelda Sequels now (And Not GB/GBC/GBA/DS Zelda's)?
Wind Waker did have a lot of flaws but I didn't actually mind it at all. I'd still preferably play it over TP, yet the constant sailing parts became pretty boring after awhile...
And half baked content?
Like dungeons and sailing.
Minish Cap wasn't rushed, to my knowledge. Remember playing through it, and nothing seemed rough around the edges. Wind Waker definitely wasn't finished, though. There are almost six unfinished dungeons, as Vampypoo pointed out, most of the islands are much smaller than initially realized, and one of the items shown in early previews never made it into the final build (some kind of lantern/torch).
Which is a shame, a lantern could help light the way to our hearts, Vampiro. :love:
I guess the difference between Wind Waker and games like Majora's Mask and Link's Awakening is the latter two were always supposed to be quick projects. They weren't rushed in the sense that they were sped up. I agree for sure that games should be finished properly like Wind Waker should have been, but not delayed to make them "absolutely perfect" like Ocarina of Time (seriously) and Twilight Princess.
Yeah. Delays aren't a bad thing, but every once in awhile they come back and bite you in the ***. Which is a shame, because not only are we made to wait, we've then waited for a game that's been picked apart and "over-polished"
TOO HUMAN YEEEEEEEEEAH!
Minish Cap isn't the type of game that needed to be in development for years.
Twilight Princess seemed to be a little rushed too. The last stretch was lazily done.
Yet it was delayed quite a bit. Go figure!
Though I still liked it :o
Twilight Princess just had shitty design to begin with anyway, it was a polished turd.